What about Turkey and Russia? Starlink doesn’t work in Russia.
Independent thinker valuing discussions grounded in reason, not emotions.
Open to reconsider my views in light of good-faith counter-arguments but also willing to defend what’s right, even when it’s unpopular. My goal is to engage in dialogue that seeks truth rather than scoring points.
What about Turkey and Russia? Starlink doesn’t work in Russia.
Agreed. The need for all kinds of mens-groups is probably higher than it has ever been. I’d love something where I could join a group of men and build / fix something together.
Free will, the sense, that you could have done otherwise, is an illusion.
We make choices based on either what we have to do, or what we want to do. There’s no freedom in having to do something, but you’re also not free to choose your wants. If you felt like having tea this morning instead of coffee, then having tea is the only thing you could have done. You wanted tea, not coffee. Now, if we rewind the clock back in time to the moment before you decided, you’d pick tea again, and again, and again. Everything else being the same, your desire for tea will override the desire for coffee every time. And you didn’t choose that desire.
already bows to actual totalitarians
Care to elaborate?
the quantity of launches and satellites is doing nothing good for anyone
Except for the millions of people accessing internet via Starlink to whom the alternative is either no internet, slow internet or extremely expensive internet.
Never miss a chance to milk some of those anti-Elon upvotes
It’s involuntary action. Not something you choose to do.
The title is essentially an argument against free will. The illusion that you could have done otherwise. Waking up early out of habit is no indication of free will to me.
To have a strong feeling to have (something); wish (to possess or do something); desire greatly: synonym: desire.
Pick any dictionary definition for it.
Well I can’t think of a voluntary action that people do for any other reason than either wanting to do it or having to do it. That’s the point of the post. Every example I have been given so far is either of those two. It feels like we’re free do to what ever, but in reality we’re only free to do what we want and nobody picked their wants.
Nobody is forcing me to reply to this message. I do it because I want to. If I didn’t want to I wouldn’t but I also don’t know why I enjoy having these debates. I didn’t choose to enjoy it, I just do.
Just give me an example of something you do or could do that you don’t have to but also don’t want to. I don’t think you can. You’re not free to do that.
By have to I mean obligations. You’ve got a meeting at noon, you have to be there. You may not want to, but you have to.
By want I mean every other voluntary action. You’re thirsty and you open the fridge. There’s milk, water and orange juice. Say you grab the orange juice. You did that because you wanted it. To say that you could have chosen milk or water isn’t true. You didn’t want those, you wanted orange juice. If you rewind the clock and open the fridge again you’d still want the orange juice. In that moment you can’t do other than what you want. You can’t choose to not want it. It may be than in a few years you no longer like orange juice so in thay sense your wants may change but then and there in that moment you can’t act against it.
Even if you decide against your preferences to prove a point you’d still be acting according to your wants; you want to prove me wrong and thus you grab the water. That’s still doing what you wanted to do.
My motivation here is only to probe on what other people really think of when using that word, so that I know what they really mean by it
That makes sense. In my mind the definition never really evolved as I tend to take words literally and think of it more as a category, like “red heads” rather than as an ideological group. I guess that would technically make them a subgroup of incels.
But the term itself implies the former
Maybe they should be called far-incels
Were I complaining?
I asked chatGPT to extract the question from that as I struggled to pinpoint it myself. I’ll put it here as I’m probably not the only one wondering. So it seems like what OP is asking is (correct me if I’m wrong):
How do you adjust or change your beliefs (about capitalism, communism, libertarianism, or other ideologies) to deal with the fact that some people or countries naturally have more advantages than others?
It’s what they wanted to do at that time then. Why else would they do it? I mean really, think about it. Why would you choose to do something like that other than it’s what you felt like doing at the time.
I have a bad habit of biting my nails. It would be correct to say that it’s something I do despite not wanting to but that wouldn’t exactly be true because when I catch myself about to do it and I resists, it’s hard because I really want to do it despite knowing I shouldn’t.
It’s more like the person I want to be being in conflict with the person I actually am.
I wore a beanie this morning as it was quite chilly outside.
Yesterday I wore a helmet while riding my bike. Not sure if that counts as a hat.
People don’t do stuff they don’t want to to because they couldn’t think of anything better to do. If you decide to just stay in and lay in bed because you couldn’t think of anything better to do then laying in bed is what you preferred to do above everything else, otherwise you’d be doing something else.
Well not really. We’ve lived without free will just fine untill now so becoming aware of it’s absence doesn’t really change much.
What it does change for me however is that the flipside of it is no self, meaning there’s no free will because there’s no one making choices. I don’t believe in the imagined “me” that’s located behind my eyes and looking out into the world and authoring my actions. This pretty much pulls the rug out of blame. Who am I blaming exactly? The universe?