Hi! Absolutely none game with Steam Proton doesn’t works! But when I use Wine-GE with Lutris (or just use Wine-GE instead of Steam Proton) - everything works fine! Where’s the issue may be? 🤔
Devuan does not use systemd, it uses … sysvinit, or OpenRC, or runnit.
Basically the entire linux ecosystem is built around and on top of systemd… other init based OSs that try to run most linux software… will encounter many absurd and esoteric problems, all of which ultimately stem from the fact that the vast majority of linux software is developed with systemd as the default, assumed, init system.
Basically, any Linux OS that doesn’t use systemd should be considered entirely experimental, beyond any software that the OS devs explicitly state they support.
Some non-systemd OS developers will dedicate time to either forking or patching certain, specific, existing software or libraries to be compatible with all the init systems their OS supports, but realistically, given the niche nature of such OSs and their small dev teams, they are always going to be months to years behind the current support level for systemd based OSs.
You could attempt to fix this specific issue you are having, but it would likely require you to essentially become an OS developer.
It would be vastly easier to simply switch from Devuan over to standard Debian, which runs Steam and Proton and such pretty much just fine.
…will encounter many absurd and esoteric problems, all of which ultimately stem from the fact that the vast majority of linux software is developed with systemd as the default, assumed, init system.
Unless the application in question is directly interacting with systemd, then I believe this is overblown.
Applications largely simply expect certain features to be supported. DNS, for example, could be provided by systemd-resolvd or by dnscrypt-proxy.
This isn’t being built around systemd, this is being built around the expectation of a feature. This feature can be provided by different applications and still function.
In my experience, providing the features expected is far more important than providing specifically the systemd API.
Basically, any Linux OS that doesn’t use systemd should be considered entirely experimental, beyond any software that the OS devs explicitly state they support.
Hard disagree.
I think the init system is more abstracted away from the developers of a game/typical user app than you are implying.
In my experience, providing the features expected is far more important than providing specifically the systemd API.
Which is why I said:
…will encounter many absurd and esoteric problems, all of which **ultimately stem from the fact ** that the vast majority of linux software is developed with systemd as the default, assumed, init system.
Your OS is software.
It is a gigantic maze for a non linux pro to try to figure out all of these alternate dependencies that are needed, need to be configured, and whether or not they even play nice with each other, whether or not they won’t throw you into dependency conflict hell.
Generally speaking, when a normal person, who isn’t a linux expert… installs an OS… they expect that it will more or less work out of the box at a fundamental level, that it will come pre-bundled with dependencies and configurations that allow them to use the software they want to use.
Hard disagree.I think the init system is more abstracted away from the developers of a game/typical user app than you are implying.
Ok, two responses to that:
You ever tried gaming on a non systemd OS?
Granted, its been a few years, but I have, and its a fucking nightmare along the lines I described… tons of insane, esoteric nonsense going wrong all over the place, that requires you to functionally develop a solid workaround schema for everything you are trying to do, that may as well qualify you as a developer of or contributor to the OS.
I don’t see anyone, anywhere, recommending a non systemd linux OS for gaming.
Second response: Okey dokey, then I’m sure you’ll be able to prove that by solving this person’s problem for them within Devuan.
Solving a random non-systemd user’s issue is irrelevant, even if we knew a lot more about their setup.
Yep, here we are in a tech support thread for some person with some issue, I have provided a solution to that issue, you are arguing that solving the person’s issue is irrelevant.
Okie dokie!
… You say you’ve gotten gaming on a non systemd os to work.
If … it worked with Steam… and Proton… perhaps you could suggest that OS, and whatever custom config you used, to this person?
You know, as opposed to Devuan, which is apparently set up incorrectly, out of the box, for this user?
I have firsthand experience with videogames made for one flavor of Linux not working on my machine due to dependency hell.
You know exactly the problem I am describing that comes along with trying to game on a non systemd OS, because you have experienced it yourself.
You get stuck in dependency hell because all the supporting software that is required for modern gaming… is a large mismatch, by default os config, with what is actually compatible with and developed for non systemd systems, and it requires a massive amount of effort to get anything into a reasonably stable and reasonably working state.
I ask you to provide your experience directly, which could genuienly help this person, and you instead want to nitpick vocabulary in a sophomoric manner so that you can feel you are more correct by virtue of ‘well, ackshually’…
…and your approach to trying to solve the problem is robotic, run through standard error output log, identify error… theorize solution…
… even though you personally know that approach will be very time consuming and frustrating.
I truly wish there was some simple misconfiguration that you could change, or some reasonable hotfix that could easily be trouble shot by randos on lemmy…
But in all likelihood… yeah, you’d have to basically develop Devuan to support Proton, or develop Proton to support Devuan, or potentially both.
If you wanna do gaming on linux, right now I’d suggest Bazzite as probably the most user friendly, hard to break, runs games and most other software well alternative.
You could also just switch back to plain Debian, its not quitr as user friendly or gamer optimized, but it absolutely will work.
On the other hand, if you wanna jump into a different Debian based system… PikaOS is still somewhat experimental, but it is basically a stripped down and gamer-optimized version of Debian, its based on systemd so you won’t have these kinds of problems… and from recent benchmark tests I’ve seen, it actually outperforms Bazzite, Nobara, CentOS, many other common distros typically suggested for linux gaming… meaning, more FPS for the same game at the same settings on the same hardware.
If you are new to linux, and you want something that basically ‘just works’, I’d suggest you try Bazzite first.
It is much easier for a person with little linux experience to use.
Linux is kind of infamous for allowing the user to have the ability to customize and alter basically every aspect of the OS.
This is great for very experienced linux users, but it can often lead newer linux users to accidentally … basically destroying their OS.
Bazzite has good functionality, comes with pre configured tweaks to make gaming performance better, comes with apps gamers commonly use, much much easier… and, the way it is designed, it basically has a bunch of built in safety mechanisms to make it much more difficult to break the OS.
I have never actually used PikaOS… if you are considerably experienced with Debian based distros, I’d guess you could probably handle it…
But if you are brand new to linux, and mostly just want something that works for games, and other fairly common desktop apps?
I’d go with Bazzite.
If you do decide to switch OSs, please remember to make a backup copy of all your personal files on a seperate harddrive before you make the switch.
On the other hand… you could wait it out and see if other people in this thread can actually troubleshoot and solve your problem.
Personally, I am doubtful they will be able to, but I do not know everything, and I could be wrong, perhaps there is some fairly straightforward fix.
What are these apps? Because I don’t use Discord or other “not-privacy”-friendly apps. I use only Steam of these 😅. Because from Steam I only plays in FA with my friend. For communication - I use Mumble for example.
it basically has a bunch of built in safety mechanisms to make it much more difficult to break the OS
Is this actually Linux? 🤔
please remember to make a backup copy of all your personal files on a seperate harddrive before you make the switch
It’s too late 🙃
Personally, I am doubtful they will be able to, but I do not know everything, and I could be wrong, perhaps there is some fairly straightforward fix.
I also already doubt this 😟. And I’ve already cleaned that machine.
Well, you have things like EmuDeck, for emulating console games,
Lutris, for an alternative, non Steam way to run games via WINE or Proton,
Protontricks to help manage and configure WINE and Proton…
A whole bunch of other stuff that may or may not interest you.
Is this actually Linux?
Yes, it is, it is built off of the Fedora Atomic model.
So… the simple explanation is that the core operating system is read-only, unalterable, in most situations.
The core libraries of the OS are managed by the developers, who make the ‘recipe’ of all the core stuff, and update it and occasionally add to it… the user can override this and add in new core libraries, but it is highly advised against, and the terminal will yell at you that you are probably doing something stupid when you try.
That being said, if you do mess up the core libraries… you can use
rpm-ostree rollback
And that will revert you to the last, stable, bootable configuration, which it automatically keeps backups of, locally.
Then, almost all applications and software are run through flatpak, which keeps them self-contained, so if they break, it is only them that break, not your whole system.
If you want to do something that requires more control over a linux in a tradtional linux sense… Bazzite comes with DistroBox, which basically allows you to have multiple linux oss download their own libraries in their own box, and then you can do more advanced tinkering in there.
(technically it is quite complicated, as i understsnd it, distrobox is basically … customized, fancy docker images, if you are familiar with docker)
It’s too late 🙃
sigh
I tried.
I tried to warn you!
I also already doubt this 😟. And I’ve already cleaned that machine.
I… I hope you do already know how to… flash an iso to a usb drive, and that you have not just wiped out your only means of downloading said iso.
Yeap! I almost an advanced user 🙃. I reinstall an OS on my PC about 9.999.999.999 times… (maybe a little bit less)
But I want to try firstly that here’s someone can hint me 😉
Yes, it is, it is built off of the Fedora Atomic model.
So… the simple explanation is that the core operating system is read-only, unalterable, in most situations.
The core libraries of the OS are managed by the developers, who make the ‘recipe’ of all the core stuff, and update it and occasionally add to it… the user can override this and add in new core libraries, but it is highly advised against, and the terminal will yell at you that you are probably doing something stupid when you try.
That being said, if you do mess up the core libraries… you can use
rpm-ostree rollback
And that will revert you to the last, stable, bootable configuration, which it automatically keeps backups of, locally.
Then, almost all applications and software are run through flatpak, which keeps them self-contained, so if they break, it is only them that break, not your whole system.
If you want to do something that requires more control over a linux in a tradtional linux sense… Bazzite comes with DistroBox, which basically allows you to have multiple linux oss download their own libraries in their own box, and then you can do more advanced tinkering in there.
(technically it is quite complicated, as i understsnd it, distrobox is basically … customized, fancy docker images, if you are familiar with docker)
It seems that it is the most user-friendly distribution. But there’s so many proprietary softs as I guess 🤔
SystemD is a flawed init system… but in the grand scheme of things, it is the least flawed init system that’s been developed thus far, for 99% of users.
The problem is almost certainly your OS.
Devuan does not use systemd, it uses … sysvinit, or OpenRC, or runnit.
Basically the entire linux ecosystem is built around and on top of systemd… other init based OSs that try to run most linux software… will encounter many absurd and esoteric problems, all of which ultimately stem from the fact that the vast majority of linux software is developed with systemd as the default, assumed, init system.
Basically, any Linux OS that doesn’t use systemd should be considered entirely experimental, beyond any software that the OS devs explicitly state they support.
Some non-systemd OS developers will dedicate time to either forking or patching certain, specific, existing software or libraries to be compatible with all the init systems their OS supports, but realistically, given the niche nature of such OSs and their small dev teams, they are always going to be months to years behind the current support level for systemd based OSs.
You could attempt to fix this specific issue you are having, but it would likely require you to essentially become an OS developer.
It would be vastly easier to simply switch from Devuan over to standard Debian, which runs Steam and Proton and such pretty much just fine.
Unless the application in question is directly interacting with systemd, then I believe this is overblown.
Applications largely simply expect certain features to be supported. DNS, for example, could be provided by systemd-resolvd or by dnscrypt-proxy.
This isn’t being built around systemd, this is being built around the expectation of a feature. This feature can be provided by different applications and still function.
In my experience, providing the features expected is far more important than providing specifically the systemd API.
Hard disagree.
I think the init system is more abstracted away from the developers of a game/typical user app than you are implying.
But if it will works 🤔. And what can I do to do now? Remains only to have try to install some other OS.
Also I’ve try this instruction: https://github.com/lutris/docs/blob/master/HowToEsync.md
But this also was be helpless 🤷
I would look at the proton log of a game that doesn’t work.
How do I create logs of a game I run with Proton?
Proton will create a log file for a particular game, if you set the launch parameter to:
PROTON_LOG=1 %command%The log file will be created in your home folder with the name scheme
steam-$STEAMID.log. For example:$HOME/steam-379720.logAnd the end of the log:
Modules: Module Address Debug info Name (23 modules) PE 00400000-00a8a000 Export megaserval PE 7b000000-7b2a0000 Deferred kernelbase PE 7b600000-7b65f000 Deferred kernel32 PE 7bc00000-7bcaa000 Export ntdll ELF 7d000000-7d005000 Deferred <wine-loader> ELF 7e9ff000-7eb86000 Export libwine.so.1 ELF f62ea000-f63d7000 Deferred ntdll.so ELF f78e7000-f78f6000 Deferred libmd.so.0 ELF f78f6000-f790d000 Deferred libbsd.so.0 ELF f790d000-f7914000 Deferred libxdmcp.so.6 ELF f7914000-f7919000 Deferred libxau.so.6 ELF f7919000-f7947000 Deferred libxcb.so.1 ELF f7947000-f7a99000 Deferred libx11.so.6 ELF f7a99000-f7ad5000 Deferred libglx.so.0 ELF f7ad5000-f7b51000 Deferred libgldispatch.so.0 ELF f7b51000-f7c56000 Deferred libm.so.6 ELF f7c58000-f7cc4000 Deferred libgl.so.1 ELF f7cc4000-f7cc9000 Deferred librt.so.1 ELF f7cc9000-f7ef1000 Deferred libc.so.6 ELF f7ef1000-f7ef6000 Deferred libdl.so.2 ELF f7ef6000-f7efb000 Deferred libpthread.so.0 ELF f7f07000-f7f99000 Deferred gameoverlayrenderer.so ELF f7f9b000-f7fd0000 Deferred ld-linux.so.2 Threads: process tid prio name (all IDs are in hex) 00000020 steam.exe 00000024 0 00000118 0 00000130 0 00000030 services.exe 00000034 0 00000038 0 wine_rpcrt4_server 00000044 0 wine_rpcrt4_io 00000048 0 wine_threadpool_worker 00000068 0 wine_rpcrt4_io 00000074 0 wine_rpcrt4_io 00000098 0 wine_rpcrt4_io 000000b0 0 wine_rpcrt4_io 000000c4 0 000000e4 0 wine_rpcrt4_io 000000e8 0 wine_threadpool_worker 0000003c winedevice.exe 00000040 0 0000004c 0 00000050 0 wine_sechost_service 00000054 0 00000058 0 0000005c 0 000000bc 0 000000c0 0 00000060 winedevice.exe 00000064 0 0000006c 0 00000070 0 wine_sechost_service 00000078 0 0000007c 0 00000080 0 00000084 0 0000008c 0 00000090 plugplay.exe 00000094 0 0000009c 0 000000a0 0 wine_sechost_service 000000a4 0 wine_rpcrt4_server 000000a8 svchost.exe 000000ac 0 000000b4 0 000000b8 0 wine_sechost_service 000000c8 explorer.exe 000000cc 0 000000d0 0 000000d4 0 wine_rpcrt4_server 000000dc rpcss.exe 000000e0 0 000000ec 0 000000f0 0 wine_sechost_service 000000f4 0 wine_rpcrt4_server 000000f8 0 wine_rpcrt4_server 000000fc 0 wine_rpcrt4_io 00000100 0 wine_threadpool_worker 00000104 tabtip.exe 00000108 0 00000110 0 wine_rpcrt4_server 00000114 0 0000011c 0 00000128 (D) Z:\mnt\Games\Steam\steamapps\common\Mega Serval\megaServal.exe 0000012c 0 <== 00000144 0 0000013c conhost.exe 00000140 0 System information: Wine build: wine-8.0 Platform: i386 (WOW64) Version: Windows 10 Host system: Linux Host version: 6.1.0-35-amd64 1057.067:0030:0148:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_threadpool_worker" 1057.067:0030:014c:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_threadpool_worker" 1057.068:0030:0150:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_threadpool_worker" pid 15809 != 15808, skipping destruction (fork without exec?)It doesn’t seems that the problem in SystemD 🤔. Maybe…
Take the whole log and put it a pastebin like pastebin.com. Then reply with the link.
Can I use PrivateBin instead?
https://0.jaegers.net/?56551c15509bb58b#WwJnXzAmbJfk767Ac5NDykBUJndRG6nuoMmSu6ZxU1X
Here’s the begin of the log:
Proton: 1731350438 proton-8.0-5d SteamGameId: 2009720 Command: ['/mnt/Games/Steam/steamapps/common/Mega Serval/megaServal.exe'] Options: {'forcelgadd'} depot: 3.0.20250408.124536 pressure-vessel: 0.20250408.0 scout scripts: 0.20250408.0 sniper: 3.0.20250408.124536 sniper 3.0.20250408.124536 Kernel: Linux 6.1.0-35-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT_DYNAMIC Debian 6.1.137-1 (2025-05-07) x86_64 Language: LC_ALL None, LC_MESSAGES None, LC_CTYPE None Effective WINEDEBUG: +timestamp,+pid,+tid,+seh,+unwind,+threadname,+debugstr,+loaddll,+mscoree ====================== fsync: up and running. wine: RLIMIT_NICE is <= 20, unable to use setpriority safely 1048.198:0028:002c:trace:seh:install_bpf Installing seccomp filters. 1048.198:0028:002c:trace:seh:check_bpf_jit_enable enabled 0x31. 1048.201:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\wineboot.exe" at 0000000140000000: builtin 1048.208:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernelbase.dll" at 000000007B000000: builtin 1048.209:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernel32.dll" at 000000007B600000: builtin 1048.223:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\msvcrt.dll" at 0000000228280000: builtin 1048.230:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\ucrtbase.dll" at 00000002C7470000: builtin 1048.230:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\sechost.dll" at 00000001EAF60000: builtin 1048.230:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\advapi32.dll" at 00000001D8C90000: builtin 1048.234:0028:002c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\ws2_32.dll" at 0000000370F70000: builtin 1048.426:0030:0034:trace:seh:sigsys_handler SIGSYS, rax 0xffff, rip 0x600000000005. 1048.426:0030:0034:trace:seh:install_bpf Seccomp filters already installed. 1048.427:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\services.exe" at 0000000140000000: builtin 1048.433:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernelbase.dll" at 000000007B000000: builtin 1048.433:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernel32.dll" at 000000007B600000: builtin 1048.442:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\msvcrt.dll" at 0000000228280000: builtin 1048.448:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\ucrtbase.dll" at 00000002C7470000: builtin 1048.448:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\sechost.dll" at 00000001EAF60000: builtin 1048.448:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\advapi32.dll" at 00000001D8C90000: builtin 1048.451:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\rpcrt4.dll" at 0000000368420000: builtin 1048.458:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\version.dll" at 000000025DC30000: builtin 1048.458:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\setupapi.dll" at 000000036D860000: builtin 1048.461:0030:0034:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\userenv.dll" at 0000000244FC0000: builtin 1048.510:0030:0038:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_rpcrt4_server" 1048.654:003c:0040:trace:seh:sigsys_handler SIGSYS, rax 0xffff, rip 0x600000000005. 1048.654:003c:0040:trace:seh:install_bpf Seccomp filters already installed. 1048.655:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\winedevice.exe" at 0000000140000000: builtin 1048.660:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernelbase.dll" at 000000007B000000: builtin 1048.660:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernel32.dll" at 000000007B600000: builtin 1048.668:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\msvcrt.dll" at 0000000228280000: builtin 1048.674:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\ucrtbase.dll" at 00000002C7470000: builtin 1048.674:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\sechost.dll" at 00000001EAF60000: builtin 1048.674:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\advapi32.dll" at 00000001D8C90000: builtin 1048.676:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\ntoskrnl.exe" at 000000031CA90000: builtin 1048.720:003c:0040:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\rpcrt4.dll" at 0000000368420000: builtin 1048.722:0030:0044:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_rpcrt4_io" 1048.723:0030:0048:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_threadpool_worker" 1048.726:003c:0050:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_sechost_service" 1048.734:003c:004c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\drivers\\mountmgr.sys" at 00000003BE830000: builtin 1048.761:003c:004c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\version.dll" at 000000025DC30000: builtin 1048.762:003c:004c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\setupapi.dll" at 000000036D860000: builtin 1048.947:0060:0064:trace:seh:sigsys_handler SIGSYS, rax 0xffff, rip 0x600000000005. 1048.947:0060:0064:trace:seh:install_bpf Seccomp filters already installed. 1048.948:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\winedevice.exe" at 0000000140000000: builtin 1048.948:003c:0054:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\win32u.dll" at 00000002C73A0000: builtin 1048.950:003c:0054:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\gdi32.dll" at 00000002BB0A0000: builtin 1048.950:003c:0054:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\user32.dll" at 00000002169D0000: builtin 1048.954:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernelbase.dll" at 000000007B000000: builtin 1048.954:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\kernel32.dll" at 000000007B600000: builtin 1048.964:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\msvcrt.dll" at 0000000228280000: builtin 1048.970:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\ucrtbase.dll" at 00000002C7470000: builtin 1048.970:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\sechost.dll" at 00000001EAF60000: builtin 1048.970:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\advapi32.dll" at 00000001D8C90000: builtin 1048.973:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\ntoskrnl.exe" at 000000031CA90000: builtin 1049.021:0060:0064:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\rpcrt4.dll" at 0000000368420000: builtin 1049.022:0030:0068:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_rpcrt4_io" 1049.025:0060:0070:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_sechost_service" 1049.029:0030:0074:warn:threadname:NtSetInformationThread Thread renamed to L"wine_rpcrt4_io" 1049.035:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\drivers\\wineusb.sys" at 00000001E58A0000: builtin 1049.047:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\version.dll" at 000000025DC30000: builtin 1049.047:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\setupapi.dll" at 000000036D860000: builtin 1049.063:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\drivers\\hidparse.sys" at 00000002AB600000: builtin 1049.063:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\drivers\\winebus.sys" at 0000000219DA0000: builtin 1049.066:0060:006c:fixme:hid:handle_IRP_MN_QUERY_ID Unhandled type 00000005 1049.085:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\win32u.dll" at 00000002C73A0000: builtin 1049.085:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\gdi32.dll" at 00000002BB0A0000: builtin 1049.085:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\user32.dll" at 00000002169D0000: builtin 1049.085:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\drivers\\hidclass.sys" at 0000000332E40000: builtin 1049.085:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\drivers\\winehid.sys" at 00000002FE9D0000: builtin 1050.025:0060:006c:trace:loaddll:build_module Loaded L"C:\\windows\\system32\\imm32.dll" at 0000000393730000: builtin 1050.027:0060:006c:fixme:hid:handle_IRP_MN_QUERY_ID Unhandled type 00000005 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:seh:dispatch_exception code=6ba flags=0 addr=000000007B00CDB7 ip=7b00cdb7 1050.028:0060:006c:warn:seh:dispatch_exception unknown exception (code=6ba) raised 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:seh:dispatch_exception rax=0000000000b2d800 rbx=0000000000b2dae8 rcx=0000000000b2d800 rdx=0000000000000000 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:seh:dispatch_exception rsi=00000000000000cc rdi=00000000008f3e40 rbp=0000000000b2d8d0 rsp=0000000000b2d7e0 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:seh:dispatch_exception r8=0000000000000000 r9=0000000000000000 r10=00000000008f4160 r11=0000000000000014 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:seh:dispatch_exception r12=0000000000b2dae8 r13=0000000000f3c750 r14=0000000000f3c750 r15=00000000000000b8 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:seh:call_vectored_handlers calling handler at 000000031CAB5D90 code=6ba flags=0 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:seh:call_vectored_handlers handler at 000000031CAB5D90 returned 0 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:unwind:RtlVirtualUnwind type 1 rip 7b00cdb7 rsp b2d7e0 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:unwind:dump_unwind_info **** func cd48-cdbf 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:unwind:dump_unwind_info unwind info at 000000007B0AD730 flags 0 prolog 0xf bytes function 000000007B00CD48-000000007B00CDBF 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:unwind:dump_unwind_info 0xf: subq $0xc8,%rsp 1050.028:0060:006c:trace:unwind:RtlViIt takes about 30 minutes…
Ok. I’ve cleaned that machine, but don’t install there something yet 🤔. I’ll try…
Which is why I said:
Your OS is software.
It is a gigantic maze for a non linux pro to try to figure out all of these alternate dependencies that are needed, need to be configured, and whether or not they even play nice with each other, whether or not they won’t throw you into dependency conflict hell.
Generally speaking, when a normal person, who isn’t a linux expert… installs an OS… they expect that it will more or less work out of the box at a fundamental level, that it will come pre-bundled with dependencies and configurations that allow them to use the software they want to use.
Ok, two responses to that:
You ever tried gaming on a non systemd OS?
Granted, its been a few years, but I have, and its a fucking nightmare along the lines I described… tons of insane, esoteric nonsense going wrong all over the place, that requires you to functionally develop a solid workaround schema for everything you are trying to do, that may as well qualify you as a developer of or contributor to the OS.
I don’t see anyone, anywhere, recommending a non systemd linux OS for gaming.
Second response: Okey dokey, then I’m sure you’ll be able to prove that by solving this person’s problem for them within Devuan.
Next quote I’ll explain more.
Which more has to do with just being setup incorrectly, than missing systemd.
I do. It works.
Solving a random non-systemd user’s issue is irrelevant, even if we knew a lot more about their setup.
Yep, here we are in a tech support thread for some person with some issue, I have provided a solution to that issue, you are arguing that solving the person’s issue is irrelevant.
Okie dokie!
… You say you’ve gotten gaming on a non systemd os to work.
If … it worked with Steam… and Proton… perhaps you could suggest that OS, and whatever custom config you used, to this person?
You know, as opposed to Devuan, which is apparently set up incorrectly, out of the box, for this user?
Irrelevant to proving. Context.
See, this is how a stubborn insecure person acts.
You, just now:
You, 3 months ago:
You know exactly the problem I am describing that comes along with trying to game on a non systemd OS, because you have experienced it yourself.
You get stuck in dependency hell because all the supporting software that is required for modern gaming… is a large mismatch, by default os config, with what is actually compatible with and developed for non systemd systems, and it requires a massive amount of effort to get anything into a reasonably stable and reasonably working state.
I ask you to provide your experience directly, which could genuienly help this person, and you instead want to nitpick vocabulary in a sophomoric manner so that you can feel you are more correct by virtue of ‘well, ackshually’…
…and your approach to trying to solve the problem is robotic, run through standard error output log, identify error… theorize solution…
… even though you personally know that approach will be very time consuming and frustrating.
In conclusion; boy, you must be great at parties.
But if we get a fiasco - I’ll try PikaOS.
I know. But I want to solve this. It will gave me some experience in Linux Administration.
Thanks… So I don’t visits parties, and I don’t sees any sense in this.
Sorry, but that issue had nothing to do with systemd.
It’s sad 😟
I truly wish there was some simple misconfiguration that you could change, or some reasonable hotfix that could easily be trouble shot by randos on lemmy…
But in all likelihood… yeah, you’d have to basically develop Devuan to support Proton, or develop Proton to support Devuan, or potentially both.
If you wanna do gaming on linux, right now I’d suggest Bazzite as probably the most user friendly, hard to break, runs games and most other software well alternative.
You could also just switch back to plain Debian, its not quitr as user friendly or gamer optimized, but it absolutely will work.
On the other hand, if you wanna jump into a different Debian based system… PikaOS is still somewhat experimental, but it is basically a stripped down and gamer-optimized version of Debian, its based on systemd so you won’t have these kinds of problems… and from recent benchmark tests I’ve seen, it actually outperforms Bazzite, Nobara, CentOS, many other common distros typically suggested for linux gaming… meaning, more FPS for the same game at the same settings on the same hardware.
I’ll try PikaOS then…
If you are new to linux, and you want something that basically ‘just works’, I’d suggest you try Bazzite first.
It is much easier for a person with little linux experience to use.
Linux is kind of infamous for allowing the user to have the ability to customize and alter basically every aspect of the OS.
This is great for very experienced linux users, but it can often lead newer linux users to accidentally … basically destroying their OS.
Bazzite has good functionality, comes with pre configured tweaks to make gaming performance better, comes with apps gamers commonly use, much much easier… and, the way it is designed, it basically has a bunch of built in safety mechanisms to make it much more difficult to break the OS.
I have never actually used PikaOS… if you are considerably experienced with Debian based distros, I’d guess you could probably handle it…
But if you are brand new to linux, and mostly just want something that works for games, and other fairly common desktop apps?
I’d go with Bazzite.
If you do decide to switch OSs, please remember to make a backup copy of all your personal files on a seperate harddrive before you make the switch.
On the other hand… you could wait it out and see if other people in this thread can actually troubleshoot and solve your problem.
Personally, I am doubtful they will be able to, but I do not know everything, and I could be wrong, perhaps there is some fairly straightforward fix.
What are these apps? Because I don’t use Discord or other “not-privacy”-friendly apps. I use only Steam of these 😅. Because from Steam I only plays in FA with my friend. For communication - I use Mumble for example.
Is this actually Linux? 🤔
It’s too late 🙃
I also already doubt this 😟. And I’ve already cleaned that machine.
https://docs.bazzite.gg/
Well, you have things like EmuDeck, for emulating console games,
Lutris, for an alternative, non Steam way to run games via WINE or Proton,
Protontricks to help manage and configure WINE and Proton…
A whole bunch of other stuff that may or may not interest you.
Yes, it is, it is built off of the Fedora Atomic model.
So… the simple explanation is that the core operating system is read-only, unalterable, in most situations.
The core libraries of the OS are managed by the developers, who make the ‘recipe’ of all the core stuff, and update it and occasionally add to it… the user can override this and add in new core libraries, but it is highly advised against, and the terminal will yell at you that you are probably doing something stupid when you try.
That being said, if you do mess up the core libraries… you can use
rpm-ostree rollbackAnd that will revert you to the last, stable, bootable configuration, which it automatically keeps backups of, locally.
Then, almost all applications and software are run through flatpak, which keeps them self-contained, so if they break, it is only them that break, not your whole system.
If you want to do something that requires more control over a linux in a tradtional linux sense… Bazzite comes with DistroBox, which basically allows you to have multiple linux oss download their own libraries in their own box, and then you can do more advanced tinkering in there.
(technically it is quite complicated, as i understsnd it, distrobox is basically … customized, fancy docker images, if you are familiar with docker)
sigh
I tried.
I tried to warn you!
Welp.
No turning back.
It looks like you are prepared to go all the way.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-00uQzXyujI&t=152s
lol
I… I hope you do already know how to… flash an iso to a usb drive, and that you have not just wiped out your only means of downloading said iso.
Good luck!
As I know - Red Hat developed SystemD? Fedora - is Red Hat, Bazzite - is Fedora?
Yeap! It’s so)
Yeap! I almost an advanced user 🙃. I reinstall an OS on my PC about 9.999.999.999 times… (maybe a little bit less)
But I want to try firstly that here’s someone can hint me 😉
It seems that it is the most user-friendly distribution. But there’s so many proprietary softs as I guess 🤔
I’ll try someone from these. But how do we lives before SystemD then? 🤔
P.S: And Bazzite has a logo… cough-cough…
To bastardize a Winston Churchill quote:
SystemD is a flawed init system… but in the grand scheme of things, it is the least flawed init system that’s been developed thus far, for 99% of users.